RELIGION: The Pope, By Deepak Chopra

By Miren Gutierrez Reprint | | Print |

Miren Gutierrez*

ROME, Feb 5 2005 (IPS) - For the past decade Deepak Chopra has been at the forefront of a major trend in holistic healing, combining ancient wisdom and modern science. The widely celebrated New Age guru talks with IPS about Pope John Paul II, arguably one of the most significant figures of the 20th century.

For the past decade Deepak Chopra has been at the forefront of a major trend in holistic healing, combining ancient wisdom and modern science. The widely celebrated New Age guru talks with IPS about Pope John Paul II, arguably one of the most significant figures of the 20th century.

Q: With a flock of a billion Catholics and immense influence, how do you rate the Pope and his legacy?

A: I think he is an extraordinary human being. Even if we don’t agree with all what he says, he speaks with sincerity and conviction. His major contribution in the last years has been, number one, standing up against the war, being brave, bold and direct with the world leaders, particularly with (George) Bush and Tony Blair. Well, the Vatican is a state, but few people were bold enough to stand up. He has a huge ability to affect the public opinion.

And number two, in spite of his frail health, he has shown enormous vigour. I think his physical strength comes from his spiritual strength. He has been travelling the world, Africa, Asia, Latin America; it has been extraordinary.

Q: The Pope has favoured conservative movements within the Church like Opus Dei (seen by many as a fundamentalist Catholic group), and also conservative principles. He has opposed divorce and homosexual unions, defended celibacy for the clergy, and rejected the ordination of women, contraception, abortion and cloning.

A: He sincerely believes in it, so I cannot criticise him. On the other hand, I think the Church is in serious need for reform. It has to address some of these issues, particularly that of the ordination of women. Because right now it seems like God has been hijacked by men.

That has to do with male domination of politics, and even the issue of war. The result is little input from women, men dominate the world. Time will force the Church to adjust to these issues, the ordination of women, the whole question of abortion…You cannot stop technology. Cloning has huge medical benefits, and there is no way you can prevent it. The next pope will have to deal with these issues.

Q: Earlier if you didn’t agree with the pope, you might feel you had to leave the Church. That is no longer the case. Catholics now pick and choose what they want from religion. Low church attendance, a crisis of ‘vocations’, birth control and even anti-clericalism co-exist within the Catholic community. But it seems that radical Catholicism, or other radical movements, attracts loyal followers, while more moderate brands of religion lose them.. What does this tell us about the future of organised religion?

A: I think all religions, not only the radical brands of religion, have become divisive, troublesome. One of the reasons is that many ideas of religion are antiquated, come from relatively primitive times, and many of the things in religion are not supported by evolution, biology or modern cosmology.

There is a great spiritual hunger. The eternal questions remain: do we have a soul, does God exist, what’s the meaning of death and life… But the answers institutional religion gives us are not satisfactory. All the conflicts in the world are religious: in Sri Lanka, India, Iraq, Ireland… If bigotry happens because of religion, why do we have it?

Those who stay with religion is because they are believers. But if something is real, why do I have to believe in it? I don’t need to believe in electricity or gravity, I can see the evidence. If the things religion says are real, I should have a real experience and awareness of these realities.

Q: How do you think the Pope has treated other religions and cultures? John Paul has been the first pope to visit a mosque, a synagogue….

A: In some respects he has been really progressive, he has been tolerant and understanding with other faiths, but he has been also conservative. He seems to me somebody representing the confusion in the Church itself.

Q: But John Paul has said things he later regretted. He was quoted as saying Buddhism was an atheistic system…

A: He also has said that meditation was dangerous… He reflects the confusion in the Church in times of transition.

Q: He has been especially harsh with the West for its obsession with materialism. In contrast, you teach that man can be better, body and soul. What do you think about this?

A: It is an insult to talk about spirituality to a man who hasn’t fulfilled his basic needs.

Q: As a political figure, he condemned the war in Iraq, criticised what he called the "scandalous" arms trade, asked for lifting the embargo against Cuba, and for the first time in the history of the Vatican, asked for forgiveness for the crimes of the Church over the years.. Should a pope have a political role in the world affairs?

A: He is so influential, and so many millions of people listen to the words he says, that it is very laudable and wonderful that he stood up as he did. Those things we have discussed, if nothing else, overshadow all the weaknesses of the Church. To ask for forgiveness, to criticise the war in Iraq… I think it is great he did that.

Q: Until John Paul II, most popes confined themselves to Rome. While a conservative, he is also the most-travelled pope in history, having visited 133 countries. He was the first pope in the White House, in the EU parliament… Has he been a better politician than spiritual leader?

A: We are living in a time when economics, politics, environment, social issues, humanitarian issues, religion, spirituality… all influence each other. You cannot be a spiritual leader without being a political leader as well. It is important that a person who is so significant influences public opinion, and participates in what he believes.

*Miren Gutierrez is IPS Editor in Chief.